Author Topic: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.  (Read 8375 times)

Offline boatyboy

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Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« on: November 29, 2011, 10:29:37 PM »
As a Jersey resident it is very strange to hear the local politicans having a go at the fullfillment industry moving, it really is more later


Combines meticulous research with amusing anecdotes, resulting in a very readable account of the murky world of offshore and a strong moral message that the system needs to be changed.

- Financial Times

Perhaps the most important book published in the UK so far this year

- George Monbiot, The Guardian

A bombshell

- Bibi van der Zee, The Guardian

Shaxson admirably lays out the history of how tax havens have become such an insidious feature of the global economy. . . . his book will help us get serious about shutting down offshore tax abuses

- Senator Carl Levin, chair of U.S. Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations

http://treasureislands.org/praise-for-the-book/





Offline man in the street

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2011, 12:22:52 AM »
if finance goes then i will have no job.
 as things  stand today , i will get  no help from the states . what should i do?
 we cant all work the land or wait on tables .

Offline danrok

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2011, 01:41:10 AM »
If the finance industry is gone tomorrow, then forget it - game over.  The island would be bankrupt 5 minutes later, your pension is gone, the social security phone number is disconnected.

You would be luck to get a job at Snow Hill Chippy for £2 per hour.

ole razzy

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2011, 03:33:55 AM »
You would be luck to get a job at Snow Hill Chippy for £2 per hour.

Well at least you'd be warm and well fed!

But on more than one occasion I have been told by local ITK's with a long historical perspective on the political and economic developments of the Island that we are as a people 'highly entreprenurial' with the innate capacity to re-invent ourselves and our business fortunes. Ship-building, fishing, agriculture, tourism, finance - something else will follow on in time. We are just caught in the moment and without forward thinking political leadership. Nobody has a clue as what to do if finance fails. Despite all the lip service paid to economic diversification and high speed broadband.

Where are the brightest young people going Mr Education?
Why is the there no enterprize zone Mr Economic Development?
Why has nobody designed low cost live / work spaces for our most intelligent post industrial knowledge ecomony wizz kids Mr Planning?
Why is our cultural scene so inward looking and amateurish Mrs Culture?
Why is a University not on the agenda?
Why is there no business leadership foundation in Jersey?
Why are low impact / high yield software development consultancies not being targetted to our shores?
Why are there no statistics available on the current and future value of the creative ecomony to our GDP Mr Treasury?


And why have we continually been force fed the 'finance is the only game in town' shlep? And nobody in the media thinks to ask these questions?

I say there is no real vision of what our collective future might look like. No decent leadership. And a political culture of knee jerk responses to the immediate day to day short term problems.

Sorry to come over as all preachy. But if finance does get closed down we only have ourselves to blame for being the first generation in 300 years not to properly plan for the future. And all because we were too busy counting other peoples money and not thinking about how the next generation might count their own.




Offline boatyboy

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2011, 04:12:12 AM »
I have heard  that Guernsey has changed its laws, inviting all Jersey businesses large and small to be offshore if registering a company there. It will  charge a one off fee of five hundred pounds and an annual fee of one hundred and fifty pounds. This means all Jersey businesses from one man bands to larger companies will not be elligible for Jersey tax.

This is very bad news for Jersey tax revenue collecters especially as we are running a  structual deficit. There again so is Guernsey and it has every right to change tax laws to attract new business. They have learned from their richer cousins in Jersey it is all about me.

The fact that Jersey will have to close schools, cut medical care,pensions,  and not be able to maintain the services that people need is not Guernseys problem, after all they are only doing what Jersey, London, Delaware, Switzerland, luxebourg, the Cayman and Bahmas have been doing for decades.  On this occasion Guernsey has just got the lead in the race to the bottom.

Only Joking.

BB

« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 04:33:32 AM by boatyboy »

Offline ryanmorrison

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2011, 03:16:00 PM »
Razzy - from a personal point of view I think you are on the right lines - a good university specialising in technology and international law, invention and technology friendly copyright laws and world class infrastructure could lead to Jersey's next re-invention as a centre of technology, a sort of silicon island.

But there are a lot of things that would need to be put in place beyond 1gb fibre to every home and a massive back bone connection to make that reality come true. Jersey does already have a large number of very talented and creative people in that sector but it would need considerably more and a tax/copyright structure that favours entrepreneurs.

But that is just me.

Offline boatyboy

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2011, 06:09:39 PM »

Ryan and Razzy I agree, Jersey is a reasonably safe place for students being an island and if the will was there then an new industry based on education couldn be built, and several others no doubt.

The Book Treasure Islands is however the non tax bible from hell or should that be about hell. It without doubt is the book that the bankers and financial institutions do not want you to read. Is Jersey guilty of playing the game sucking money in yes it is like many other places.

Are the official signings for exchange of information agreements worth the paper they are written on, NO. As an example America has roughly 1.1 million companies registered offshore not paying the USA its proper tax dues. How many companies have been investigated under these mutual back patting worthless agreements only 5 or 6. Clearly this is a flawed system designed to hide money.

Let us remember in the race to the bottom, allowing de-regulation, and secrecy as operated by Jersey and many others, someone still has to pay to keep countries infrustructure working.

You have it, the financial institutions aided by weak Government have past the tax obligation on to the ordinary folk while still raking it in for corporates who move money legaly to the lowest tax and regulation regime..

In a perfect world when companies and the wealthy elite remained wealthy but paid their fair share of tax. Do you think the worlds economy would be bankrupt as it clearly now is.

In a wave of its magical wand the IMF is putting together a 500 billion euro bailout fund to help Italy. Can any of our big financial people who know far more than I ever will, please explain where that money is coming from given most countries in Europe are utterly bankrupt ?


As strange as it may seem Shaxton tells us that Africa needs no aid, as for every $10 dollars earned in mining etc in a country rich in diamonds and minerals, that is skimmed and leaves the country for offshore hideaways the West sends $1 dollar in aid to help its starving and uneducated. Complete madness.


The world wide rules have to be re written to examine fair taxes for all.

BB

Offline man in the street

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2011, 08:57:32 PM »
nice idea about guernseyand the migration of jersey companies, could jump on the boat , and get the duty free's at the same time ,doing the paperwork  have a lunch  and back in the evening. :)
 its hard for me to find people who remember the thirities, to talk me through what it was like  as  its hard to find  people who went through the occupation and times of nothing , and can tell you first hand  how they got through it.
 if there is to be a new game in town , lets get trainning for it.
 

Offline George

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2011, 09:37:19 PM »
Who needs the finance industry anyway? Think about it!

Just one signature from the Queen will make Jersey a full member of the UK. UK income taxes, road tax , petrol duty, 20% VAT, MOT's on Cars.  No States members with one MP elected to Westminster. How wonderful.

Offline ageofaquarius

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2011, 04:23:19 AM »
Yes George and we can all go on strike.  8) ::)

Offline man in the street

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2011, 12:50:17 PM »
 i would  want full inderpendance , over full uk rule . warts and all.

Offline Calimachon

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2011, 05:27:49 PM »
nice idea about guernseyand the migration of jersey companies, could jump on the boat , and get the duty free's at the same time ,doing the paperwork  have a lunch  and back in the evening. :)
 its hard for me to find people who remember the thirities, to talk me through what it was like  as  its hard to find  people who went through the occupation and times of nothing , and can tell you first hand  how they got through it.
 if there is to be a new game in town , lets get trainning for it.

The buzzword here surely is self-sufficiency and imagination!  That is how people got through the war years and the hard times!

Admittedly families were sometimes larger and lived mostly by the soil.  The Jersey population have become 'soft southerners'.  We all have to become mean and lean again to understand what our forebears went through.  Although in those times my perception was that the majority of people were moral or tried to be.  Might have something to do with the loss of power of the churches.

I have no answers but I would like to see a change and I think some people in Jersey are trying their utmost to get a good community going which shows that we don't all have to be so materialistic at JiT and J-Can.

http://jit.org.je/

http://j-can.org.je/


Cali :)



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Offline boatyboy

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2011, 08:49:49 PM »
Who needs the finance industry anyway? Think about it!

Just one signature from the Queen will make Jersey a full member of the UK. UK income taxes, road tax , petrol duty, 20% VAT, MOT's on Cars.  No States members with one MP elected to Westminster. How wonderful.


Jersey and its population did extremly well ( to start with ) out of finance. However with the race to the bottom regarding regulations and low taxes to keep Jersey industry in competition with other low tax areas ( hence  0 /10 ) that the wheel is heading towards full circle.

Why is it that in the UK for instance the NHS gives a maximum time to see a consultant of 16 weeks but it is normally less. In Jersey we have to pay for every visit to a doctor ( free in the UK ) then wait at least 5 months to see a consultant. Remember we are a very rich island an international finance centre. If the great God of finance is looking after Jersey so well why are our hospital waiting lists and also operating times for non life threatening ( but often painful illnesses ) so incredibly long.

The Verita report did not give a glowing thumbs up opinion of the hospital either. There has been noshortage of money over the years but for some reason finance seems to be benefiting the bankers, the lawyers and trust people who get work.

Jersey costs around 600 million to run and the tax that the finance houses bring at 10% was a mere 60 million plus of course taxes levied at the workers.

More taxes any one to prop up the finance industry by those who do not work in it ?, or the better option for Jersey is to take seriously new options and new industries.

Just like various fads ( smoking ) and business that over the years have been outlawed normally through their own greed and excesses, banking has been shown to be no better and on the downward curve. Changes will not come tomorrow but are on the way.

  BB

Offline man in the street

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2011, 10:08:59 PM »
 good links cali, i like the make do and mend  idea , i will always look  as to why some thing does not go anymore before binning it, some times its a  easy fix .
  i was reading the propoganda of the  jw  magazine that arrived , stating  that jersey  was one of the richest places in the world , as you say bb,  the service that a  non bupa customer gets , from  one of the richest places in the world , leaves a lot to be desired.

Offline danrok

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Re: Jersey is not a Tax Haven it is a very nice place.
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2011, 12:08:57 AM »
I think the idea of having a large university for local, and foreign, students is a nice one, but I wonder how difficult it could be to compete with other universities.

For example, Estonia has many universities with a good reputation, long history, very low fees, and low cost of living.