Author Topic: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.  (Read 21585 times)

Offline iruka

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Wouldn't like to be at the breakfast table in the Harper household this morning. Bet his blood pressure will be sky-high. Might tip SS over the edge too  ;)

I particularly like the bit about dinner in London at a cost of £699.

A three-month investigation by The Mail on Sunday has revealed:

  • The main witness behind Harper's decision to begin the search for bodies was a woman with a known history of psychotic fantasy and alcoholism. She named children she said she had seen jumping to their deaths from Haut de la Garenne windows and hanging from trees in the garden, where she said she also found a severed hand. None of these claims were true.
  • Eddie the sniffer dog - the animal that had supposedly found the 'scent of death' in the Portuguese flat where Madeleine McCann disappeared - no longer had a licence for UK police forensic work when Harper started using him in Jersey. Eddie, whose owner, Martin Grime, was paid £93,600 for less than five months' work, triggered the first excavations by barking at a spot where Harper's team then unearthed what was claimed to be part of a child's skull. In fact, as a Kew Gardens expert has now confirmed, it was a piece of coconut shell.
  • Financial investigators have spent months poring over the inquiry's costs. They have found they were massively inflated - not only by Harper's mismanagement, but by frequent trips to London, where he and his colleagues claimed expenses for lavish meals.
  • Harper also retained the island's only police car equipped with a numberplate recognition device for his own personal use, and its driver, PC Andrew Linsell, as his chauffeur. He ordered Linsell to pick him up from home each morning, and sometimes kept him on duty late in the evening to ferry him around.
  • Earlier this year, Harper defied a Jersey Royal Court order to return to the island to give evidence in an Haut de la Garenne abuse trial and to produce his 'day books' - the notes every UK Senior Investigating Officer (SIO) is required to make about everything he does and to store with inquiry records. Harper claimed they did not exist because Metropolitan Police security experts had advised him not to keep day books. A Scotland Yard spokeswoman denied this, saying the Met told Harper they were essential.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1217863/Bungled-Jersey-child-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html#ixzz0SwmIr8Ou

Offline rico sorda

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2009, 04:01:13 PM »
Hi Iruka

I bet the JTM breakfast table was buzzing this morning lol so many hard-ons bet the table was off the ground.. You particularly like the bit about dinner in london oh yes when you rolled over and looked into jtm eyes or was it a mirror the sexual tension must have been amazing...

We all know the the The Mail stance on this..

What is your take on Harpers reply on stuarts blog this mail article is nothing new....

Yes you can have your point of view but you seem to get off on this and what about the victims.. Yes abuse happened fact lenny harper has 3 convictions fact...

So when you and JTM have finished and cleaned up go smell the feckin coffee ....

cheers

rsx

oh and what about ACPO

Ciao
« Last Edit: October 04, 2009, 04:03:31 PM by rico sorda »
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Offline iruka

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2009, 04:18:38 PM »
Ouch - touched a nerve have I?

I'll get back to you when I have considered my response to your rather intemperate posting. You appear to making a few allegations about me, which I'm not sure you can substantiate.

Do you wish to retract anything? Your postings are normally fairly well reasoned.

Cheers

I

Offline iruka

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2009, 05:41:52 PM »
I bet the JTM breakfast table was buzzing this morning lol so many hard-ons bet the table was off the ground.. You particularly like the bit about dinner in london oh yes when you rolled over and looked into jtm eyes or was it a mirror the sexual tension must have been amazing...

No idea what you going about here, but I bet Lenny's Arbroath smokies didn't taste so good today.

Quote
We all know the the The Mail stance on this..

Duh - yeah.

Quote
What is your take on Harpers reply on stuarts blog this mail article is nothing new....

My take is that Lenny's alleged reply on Stuart's blog is nothing new either. He has not so far addressed the Mail's article today, but I expect he will, in the usual long winded way that Stuart also likes.

In his response a number of things make me uneasy.

1. His claims of doctored emails - easy to prove either way through examination of server records and or course, his sent items. Unless of course the Masons got there first and the Illuminati amended them. Interesting how it now seems that his secretary sent the emails on his behalf...

2. His rants about records - rather a detailed lot of recollections for someone who doesn't have any records of relevance to the court proceedings, and no 'day book'.

3. Increasingly it looks to me, further supported by the revelation about his dinner with a journalist in London, that his whole rush for publicity may not have been in the best interests of the enquiry, and possibly may have been self-serving. Again, I direct you to the interview with Fergal Keene on Radio 4. Listen to what he says about the RPGs.

Quote
Yes you can have your point of view but you seem to get off on this and what about the victims.. Yes abuse happened fact lenny harper has 3 convictions fact...

Yes, I am entitled to my point of view, as are you. Your suggestion that I get off on this is grossly offensive and I ask you to retract that.

There have been three convictions for abuse, yes, but nothing on the scale that Lenny was making out. Not even in the same ball park.

Quote
So when you and JTM have finished and cleaned up go smell the feckin coffee ....

Not worthy of you. Clearly you are blinded by your hero's rantings. Try a dispassionate look at the evidence and try to make a rational argument, but cheap and smutty innuendo. You may find your comments are taken more seriously.

Quote
oh and what about ACPO

What about ACPO? Could it be that Lenny got himself confused with NPIA? He doesn't mention them visiting...

Later, Anne Harrison, the NPIA's head of operational support, paid several visits to Jersey with a former Met commander, Andre Baker. In his website article, Harper says these visits are evidence that his conduct of the case was 'fully endorsed' at UK national level.
However, asked whether he had 'endorsed' Harper's actions, Baker said through a spokeswoman: 'The investigation remains the sole responsibility of the investigating force, the Senior Investigating Officer and the chief officer.'
As for Harrison, said Neyroud, she was appalled to see Harper had completely ignored crucial parts of the Murder Manual and the NPIA's advice about dealing with the media. Neyroud said: 'Working out and sticking to a media strategy is also vital. Harper simply didn't have one.'


Our course The Mail may be wrong, but Anne Harrison is a Detective Chief Superintendent in the NPIA.

I

Offline danrok

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2009, 06:59:13 PM »
The Daily Mail are infamous liars and are paid money by the States of Jersey.  What else is there to know?

Offline iruka

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2009, 07:14:31 PM »
The Daily Mail are infamous liars and are paid money by the States of Jersey.  What else is there to know?

And your evidence is....?

Offline danrok

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2009, 07:38:36 PM »
And your evidence is....?

The paper is the evidence, and the crap printed therein.

There is no end of articles which dissect and examine stories from the Daily Mail...
http://www.google.com/search?q=daily+mail+lies

Offline rico sorda

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2009, 08:04:45 PM »
No idea what you going about here, but I bet Lenny's Arbroath smokies didn't taste so good today.

Duh - yeah.

My take is that Lenny's alleged reply on Stuart's blog is nothing new either. He has not so far addressed the Mail's article today, but I expect he will, in the usual long winded way that Stuart also likes.

In his response a number of things make me uneasy.

1. His claims of doctored emails - easy to prove either way through examination of server records and or course, his sent items. Unless of course the Masons got there first and the Illuminati amended them. Interesting how it now seems that his secretary sent the emails on his behalf...

2. His rants about records - rather a detailed lot of recollections for someone who doesn't have any records of relevance to the court proceedings, and no 'day book'.

3. Increasingly it looks to me, further supported by the revelation about his dinner with a journalist in London, that his whole rush for publicity may not have been in the best interests of the enquiry, and possibly may have been self-serving. Again, I direct you to the interview with Fergal Keene on Radio 4. Listen to what he says about the RPGs.

Yes, I am entitled to my point of view, as are you. Your suggestion that I get off on this is grossly offensive and I ask you to retract that.

There have been three convictions for abuse, yes, but nothing on the scale that Lenny was making out. Not even in the same ball park.

Not worthy of you. Clearly you are blinded by your hero's rantings. Try a dispassionate look at the evidence and try to make a rational argument, but cheap and smutty innuendo. You may find your comments are taken more seriously.

What about ACPO? Could it be that Lenny got himself confused with NPIA? He doesn't mention them visiting...

Later, Anne Harrison, the NPIA's head of operational support, paid several visits to Jersey with a former Met commander, Andre Baker. In his website article, Harper says these visits are evidence that his conduct of the case was 'fully endorsed' at UK national level.
However, asked whether he had 'endorsed' Harper's actions, Baker said through a spokeswoman: 'The investigation remains the sole responsibility of the investigating force, the Senior Investigating Officer and the chief officer.'
As for Harrison, said Neyroud, she was appalled to see Harper had completely ignored crucial parts of the Murder Manual and the NPIA's advice about dealing with the media. Neyroud said: 'Working out and sticking to a media strategy is also vital. Harper simply didn't have one.'


Our course The Mail may be wrong, but Anne Harrison is a Detective Chief Superintendent in the NPIA.

I

I will reply later but just a quick one..

Why with all your quotes you left out the 3 convictions just like the mail any reason for this ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
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Offline Dundee

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2009, 08:17:13 PM »
The Daily Mail are infamous liars and are paid money by the States of Jersey.  What else is there to know?

And the conservative party are sun readers  ;D

Offline iruka

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2009, 08:32:00 PM »
I will reply later but just a quick one..

Why with all your quotes you left out the 3 convictions just like the mail any reason for this ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

Oh - sorry.

I thought they spoke for themselves really.

£20m for convictions of:
an unfortunate young man (at the time) who admitted serious offences
a man whose offences, whilst bad, are not of the "child murdering, child torturing" levels alleged by Lenny - by ANY stretch of the imagination
a person unconnected with Haut de la Garenne

Hmmm...

Did it really warrant all that fuss and bother?

Surely these convictions would have been achieved without all that press hype.

We need to know - did the press hype actually bring forward any useful additional evidence or allegations, or did it simply serve to unearth  the sue, grabbit and run lawyers and nutters. How much time was spent investigating additional and unsupported allegations from people who were later proved to have not even been in HdelaG at the time of their allegation?

Time which would have been usefully spent investigating the real crimes for which they ultimately secured convictions. Not, I suspect, down to Lenny at all.

He was on a fishing trip and that is inexcusable.



Offline rico sorda

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2009, 09:05:42 PM »
Aubin was a child at HdelaG & wateridge a worker how do you think they landed in court not because of the bloody tooth fairy what about all the dropped cases take a look at the Bonner case

Dude are you in the zone or what

rs

ps the other thing that is giving me a chuckle at the moment is the 20 million its going up like a rocket

What the hell is steve austin vautier up too

That mail article is just a joke

Did it really warrant all the fuss and bother... That sums you up my friend that one line speaks louder than a 1000 posts you could land on here...

Why not meet me for a pint and have a good old chat about it...

rs 

rs
« Last Edit: October 04, 2009, 09:14:45 PM by rico sorda »
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Offline rico sorda

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2009, 10:13:04 PM »
Now this a strange one from the mail...

David Warcup jerseys acting police chief told the mail on sunday that he had appointed an independant team of auditors to examine harpers spending.. It includes

Two forensic accountants & a police expert in seizing criminal assets ....     WOW what the hell is austin vautier doing

Who the hell is paying for that is it us the TAXPAYER is it in the 20million bill... But hang this is the best feckin bit

The interim report has been seen by the mail i repeat the interim report has been seen by the mail

WHO THE BLOODY HELL SHOWED THEM

Is Warcup out of control does Warcup work for the mail

Everyone should read the mail article its just funny

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Offline Dundee

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2009, 12:40:44 AM »
All very sad. Lenny Henry has a lot to answer for.

Offline iruka

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2009, 06:49:47 AM »
All very sad. Lenny Henry has a lot to answer for.

I wonder how he explains this (also from the Mail so can't be true according to some people)

For example, in 2003, two years after Harper became deputy police chief, his detectives learnt that a former resident of Haut de la Garenne was saying he had been taken on boat trips between the ages of six and ten and subjected to repeated and serious sexual assaults.
But instead of investigating the alleged abuser, the police charged the victim for trying to blackmail his assailant.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1217863/Bungled-Jersey-child-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html#comments#ixzz0T2ITxuO2

Offline Ashley

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Re: Bungled Jersey child abuse probe branded a '£20million shambles'.
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2009, 11:05:03 AM »
20 million isn't even a realistic figure to come up with.

I'd imagine they came to this figure by adding up the entire police forces salaries since investigations began.  They then added up the total possible income from HdlG if it had been turned into a luxury 7 star Hotel and moved to the Seychelles as well as Lenny's lunch.

It's desperate. Anyone who reads The Mail has no interest in facts or figures whatsoever.