The Jersey Democratic Alliance

[Jason the Maverick]

I don't think so some how!

What about all the other independants?

You can't order people to support a party.

[AHITS]

This group is just a load of confused Tories. I think I may have to leave. YOu obviously want Walker and Le Sueur in power as you have burnt all your bridges with anyone who opposes them.

That's an interesting attitude Mongo.

It seems a little extreme to suggest that if someone voices a level of unhappiness with one of the alternatives, that they have "burnt their bridges". Given Le Sueur's recent record some people may be inclined to vote for what they see as the lesser of two evils....which could on the day be a JDA candidate.

If you don't agree with what's being said here, rather than making an announcement about leaving, stay and have YOUR say about the issue, and maybe you'll enlighten someone else enough to change their opinion.

The nature of democracy means that in any open discussion forum you're sometimes going to be confronted with views you don't like.  But never forget that same openess also provides you with a platform.

[Terminator 4]

The facebook membership of the JDA is what? 38?

Now if this party wants to get in then it will not get in with 38 votes.  Walker is stepping down and Le Sueur is in his last period of office, so Mongo is talking rubbish.

[JACKSBACK]

I will be voting for them bacause they are the only alternative at the moment.

[Deputy Dawg]

I will be voting for them bacause they are the only alternative at the moment.

]

I don't think anyone has a problems with votes for the JDA, I believe what has been mentioned is the change that will be required in order for the JDA to actually get more than the 38 votes it has at the moment to something resembling a party victory.

The JDA on their current track are not going to get anywhere, that does not mean that because I or others can see this, that we are automatically siding with Walker or Le Sueur, but it does mean that any new candidates (party or single) will be taken more seriously this year than any other year. It is the year that the JDA can make a difference if they have a massive shake up and change their view back to a democratic party and not a labour party.

Going back in history a little. Ted Vibert got together like minded individuals who wanted to see change. Ted kept the party together even though it was made up of people who were from both sides of the political spectrum, left as well as right. He kept them together knowing that this was the best way for a party to win in the elections. Those left would vote for their preferred left democratic member, those right would vote for their right democratic member, but each democratic member sang off the same hymn sheet because the members met in the middle on the views. Not all the views were fully agreed with, but democracy was the name of the game and it was voted for. Tony did not see this same view that Ted had, and so discourse raced throughout the JDA in a matter of months through infighting and left/right issues instead of democracy issues. Tony handed in his notice, and the race for chairman was fought between a far right and a far left which should never have been the case.

This eventually led to the split of the JDA. Those right wingers went to the centre party and the left wingers stayed in the JDA, however the general public has seen that the JDA is now a left wing party and the Centre Party now under the new name "Jersey Conservative Party" is all but closed and gone with no candidates or possibly members.

Should the JDA wish to return to the hay day similar to Ted's rule, then they will need to absorb the same view of the party that Ted had, a party made up of the best ideas from both sides of the political spectrum, however to do that, a chairman will be needed who is neither left nor right and who can see the best ideals without needing to placate any one side over the decision of which is best. Time for Deputy Southern to stand down and also his puppet chairman.

[Millennium Man]

AHITS has a point, people probably vote for Le Sueur & Co because it is 'better the devil they know'.

Geoff Southern seems to ony represent the States of Jersey manual worker, so the finance industry worker will see no benefits in voting for him or his JDA, and that is a lot of votes.

Senator Ozouf will probably get the backing of the finance industry so he will get back in again.

The JDA has really shown no support for the finance industry and as it is the Island's main source of tax revenue, this is probably why the facebook membership is so small. 

[Jason the Maverick]

I wouldn’t mind getting Geoff Southern to join the forum and give us his views.  Unfortunately, at the moment, I think Joe only has a speculate view of the JDA.

[David Rotherham]

I am not sure that the discussion on this forum is really of a good enough quality to be worth my while. However, having looked at this rubbish, I may as well answer it this time.
Point one: The JDA is not, has never been and is unlikely to become a socialist party. The handful of socialists among the diverse Council members are canny about not pushing it with the rest of us.
Point two: The Facebook group has little relevance to the JDA itself: Most of the Facebook group are expatriates and their friends, and some probably imposters. Only three of the Facebook group are actually JDA members, and one of those now lives in Thailand.
Point three: Geoff Southern long ago baled out of the top job, and neither of his successors have been his puppets. Both come from a small business background, like many of the JDA's supporters, not a union one. We all have plenty of shared concerns about where Jersey is going, though, and can work together.

[Jason the Maverick]

With all due respect, when you say 'work together' and then say people are posting rubbish about the JDA then that is not 'working together'!

From some of these comments I get the impression that the JDA to many is a bit of an enigma at the moment.

But dismissing peoples comment as not serious won't make people change them.

[Deputy Dawg]

A couple of points David,

I don't remember seeing your name in the original JDA or seeing you on the podium at the fort? I can though remember some of those that were there and it was a really mixed bunch from Finance to retired garden workers, at that time a true democratic party. Now truly democratic no more.

answering your points, the JDA may not be called a socialist party, but that is the view of the majority of people who do see it. This is mainly due to the fact that Geoff Southern has very very strong socialist views and runs the party. You state that he baled out when it is clear from political meetings that he is still very much in the driving seat. Going to the constables elections was a mockery as Alvin was being prepped as to what to say by Geoff, on occasion in front of all onlookers, I personally noticed this at two of the hustings. Alvin was even unable to answer questions without the notes from Geoff. While he may have others listed as chairmen, such as the husband of a fellow socialist and deputy, one does not need a great deal of intelligence to see why this smoke and mirror attempt was thrown up, but if you can't see it, it was to try to fool the general public into believing it was not run by Geoff.

You also only need to look at the JDA forum isthisjersey.com to see how left wing the JDA is.

You do have one important point though which I will concede. We do have shared concerns, JDA, non party, new party, whichever, and that is that GST and other issues that are making our lives hell will need the concertive effort of socialists and all other ists to get this changed by removing enough of the 28 who voted for it and getting another to remove it and replace it with an alternative solution.

IF you truly believe that the JDA could on their own without any help from other politicians (who may not be politicians yet) make these changes then you are a little deluded, it is also important for me to acknowledge that any new politicians will also need the help of the JDA politicians to make these changes, though they will need to field more than three in the next elections.

My view of the JDA is fully justified you are totally justified to have your own view, but please do not try to tell me that you are correct and I am not, it just does not work that way.

[AHITS]

I am not sure that the discussion on this forum is really of a good enough quality to be worth my while.

That's a real vote-winner of an attitude David....

[Jason the Maverick]

DD has made some very valid points here. I myself have been very critical of the forum isthisjersey and I have even said on that forum that I find an administrator that posts anti-finance propaganda with pro-JDA material intermittently confusing.

The JDA argument has always been that isthisjersey is just an open forum and that the JDA material and anti-financial material is just coincidental.  But I believe it actually goes deeper than that.

If the JDA really wants to raise its profile than it must distance itself from ATTAC and suchlike between now and the elections.

I have nothing against Geoff Southern and I think many of his views are correct.  His recent views of GST is a vote winner, yet his recent protection of JT staff when people are made redundant in Jersey all the time is one sided when viewed upon by a worker in finance.

Over the past 18 months we have had 100s of finance workers that have been made redundant and not once has the JDA shown any concern.

[Chief Minister]

Point two: The Facebook group has little relevance to the JDA itself: Most of the Facebook group are expatriates and their friends, and some probably imposters. Only three of the Facebook group are actually JDA members, and one of those now lives in Thailand.

The Facebook group has masses of relevance.  How can you compare an a 'Say no to GST' group with over 1,500 members and the 'JDA Group' that has less than 40?

Speaks volumes to me.

[Terminator 4]

I will be voting for them bacause they are the only alternative at the moment.

You must be joking!  I would prefer to have the current people in than the JDA. 

[JACKSBACK]

The JDA care about the people that cannot afford this style of dictatorship and they will have 19,000 votes in October.